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Anon Deleted Posts : Location : Status : Offline	Hi and a few questions Hi everyone. Yesterday I placed the winning bid on a 1972 CF with a Debonair body. I've been wanting a Debonair for a sometime (a CA actually) but figured a CF would be easier to live with, if not quite so cute. It's in OK condition & comes complete with a weezing 1600cc lump. I've spent the last few days trawling through the forum getting familiar with what's going on & learning loads. I'm looking to do a Frontera Turbo Diesel conversion, an axle swap and run it on vege oil. I'm running my current van on WVO and have built a filtration contraption to process the oil from a chip shop so I'm a little out of practice when it comes to paying £1.30+ for fuel. The 2.3 Frontera engine (with a front beam, sump, rocker & oil pipe swap) seems to be a bolt up job, however I wonder if the 1600 gearbox is up to it? Is the 'box the same as later vans? Or should I be looking for a later 'box too? Also, what engine electrics should I looking to get from the Frontera donor? I'm assuming/hoping there is no ECU on a 2.3 Frontera engine, but there would be a little wiring involved to swap from petrol electrics to the diesel electrics. Cheers Finn ----------------------
Sun 30 Oct 2011 @ 18:46
Anon Deleted Posts : Location : Status : Offline	Hello Finn, Congratulations on buying a nice van. The first question I must ask you, your address says you're in London, does that put you inside the Low Emission Zone or are you, fortunately, outside it? I have run a diesel engine in my previous CF but this time I've opted for LPG which is basically costing me 16p a mile in fuel. Hope this helps. Rae & Ann ----------------------
Sun 30 Oct 2011 @ 19:04
Anon Deleted Posts : Location : Status : Offline	Frontera 2.3D engine won't marry to the Vauxhall gearbox. Really needs the CF Opel 2.3D clutch housing for either the Opel 4-speed (similar side turret for the gear lever) or ZF 4- or 5-speed; either will require propellor shaft swap or modification & ZF box needs spacers on the transmission cross member ends to clear underside of cab floor. Frontera 2.3D injection pump may have sensors attached for an ECU: best to run it with ECU (better cold starting etc.). ----------------------
Sun 30 Oct 2011 @ 19:05
Anon Deleted Posts : Location : Status : Offline	Yep, I'm in the LEZ, but tax exempt = LEZ exempt. Hmmm, not as simple as I thought. I did consider LPG, but would like to get a few more horses under the hood. Given the work & parts involved in a 2.3 slant upgrade I figured it makes sense to do a diesel conversion.
Sun 30 Oct 2011 @ 20:05
Anon Deleted Posts : Location : Status : Offline	Also, wondering what diff ratio it is likely to have?
Sun 30 Oct 2011 @ 20:13
Anon Deleted Posts : Location : Status : Offline	Kooda wrote: but tax exempt = LEZ exempt. Hello Finn, What a result. Is it just tax exempt vehicles that are LEZ exempt or does it run a bit later? Rae & Ann ----------------------
Sun 30 Oct 2011 @ 20:32
Anon Deleted Posts : Location : Status : Offline	Just tax exempt I'm afraid. It was a big factor in choosing this particular van.
Sun 30 Oct 2011 @ 21:27
Anon Deleted Posts : Location : Status : Offline	Kooda wrote: Just tax exempt I'm afraid. It was a big factor in choosing this particular van. Hello Finn, I can fully understand the attractions of said van Rae & Ann ----------------------
Sun 30 Oct 2011 @ 21:32
Anon Deleted Posts : Location : Status : Offline	Hi Finn, I would just like to say welcome to the world of CF and good luck with your van. Where abouts in the big smoke are you? It seems you may be the nearest club member to us so maybe in the future there could be a mini convoy to a meet? Steve
Mon 31 Oct 2011 @ 18:16
Anon Deleted Posts : Location : Status : Offline	Hi Steve, I'm living in the Hounslow area. I was wondering if there were any members close by as I often see a late model coach built CF parked in Chiswick. Finn
Mon 31 Oct 2011 @ 20:38
Anon Deleted Posts : Location : Status : Offline	I've been really struggling to find info on the Opel bell housings & what fits what or does all the Opel stuff just bolt together. Phil, Are the ZF bell housings for Opel pattern engines? So this : http://www.ebay.co.uk/itm/bedford-cf-2-5speed-gearbox-/280765270677?pt=UK_CarsParts_Vehicles_CarParts_SM&hash=item415eea0a95 would do the job on the Frontera engine? With the cross member mod of course. Many thanks, Finn
Tue 01 Nov 2011 @ 20:55
Anon Deleted Posts : Location : Status : Offline	Frontera 2.3D is the same block as the GM 2.3D in the CF so a ZF box from a CF Opel diesel should bolt on ok. Diesel clutch housing has the timing pointer aperture in the bottom; CF2 ZF box on ebay looks like it's got the petrol clutch housing. ----------------------
Tue 01 Nov 2011 @ 21:02
Anon Deleted Posts : Location : Status : Offline	Kooda I have just sent the seller a question asking for the ratios as there are 2 different 5 speed boxes. ----------------------
Tue 01 Nov 2011 @ 22:35
Anon Deleted Posts : Location : Status : Offline	also in london we,re also in london, brixton/stockwell us londoners should have a little meet sometime. One thing if you change the engine in a tax exempt LEZ compliant van will it not change the LEZ rating and also we're changing the use of our ice cream van to a camper will that change anything cheers john&louise
Tue 01 Nov 2011 @ 23:17
Anon Deleted Posts : Location : Status : Offline	I used to live in Brixton, behind St Matthews church. No, a Tax exempt diesel is also LEZ exempt, so the engine swap wont effect the LEZ status. They don't care about the use of the vehicle, just the cash, I'm afraid. If it is going to effect your van it might be worth asking a few questions as to exact mechanics of things. I was quoted £3000 for a Diesel Particulate filter (DPF) and paperwork, while you can buy a new DPF of our favorite auction site for £200. I havn't looked any further into it as I've bought the Bedford instead. Gethin, He is sending me a pic of the ID plate on the 'box. I'm not sure what I'm looking for but hope it will be apparent. Sounds like its the wrong bell housing for me anyway. I have found a GM 4 speed diesel box, but would like the 0.81 5th. I saw there were 2 gear sets on the history page. The wide ratio might be nice with a high diff ratio (3.5 or something from somewhere) giving a long cruising gear while maintaining the spread. Or of course the closer ratio for better lap times.
Wed 02 Nov 2011 @ 10:39
Anon Deleted Posts : Location : Status : Offline	The reality of this wee project is sinking in. The crux of it seems to be getting the CF front beam for a diesel. I found one with disc's but upon explaining to the chap what I intended doing, he thought it was such a good idea he was now going to keep the beam.
Thu 03 Nov 2011 @ 10:12
Anon Deleted Posts : Location : Status : Offline	Your van may be tax exempt as it is, by placing a deisel lump in it would you still be compliant with the LEZ as by putting a later engine in counter act it, even though you'll still be tax exempt by the age of the van? may be worth checking out first. Congrats with buying your van, and hope you have a lot of fun and miles with it. Message for the COW. you would still be liable for the LEZ, the LEZ applies to all vehicles with deisel engines euro 3 or under, unless you have an approved particulate filter fitted, and then that would be part of your MOT emmissions check every year to make you LEZ compliant. read my blog in general chat regards the LEZ. ----------------------
Sun 13 Nov 2011 @ 19:54
Anon Deleted Posts : Location : Status : Offline	welcome to the club finn looks like im in the middle as im in beckton :) ----------------------
Sun 13 Nov 2011 @ 20:34
Anon Deleted Posts : Location : Status : Offline	I picked up the van yesterday just north of Newcastle, then drove to Scotland to pick up a 5 speed ZF box and 9/37 CWP & Diff. I stopped over 1/2 way and rolled up in London about lunch time today. Buying a van unseen via ebay is not my desired M.O. but I think it's an OK deal. I was surprised how peppy the 1600cc engine was, but it really needs a tune & the ignition sorting out. I'm not to fussed about sorting out the ignition as I picked up a 23DTR out of a Frontera on Friday & my energy is best placed on the conversion. One thing I didn't really get a handle on was the clutch/flywheel requirements. The engine has a clutch & flywheel, so I'll just see how they marry up (or not). Plenty of food for thought.
Sun 13 Nov 2011 @ 22:27
Anon Deleted Posts : Location : Status : Offline	spence wrote: Your van may be tax exempt as it is, by placing a deisel lump in it would you still be compliant with the LEZ as by putting a later engine in counter act it, even though you'll still be tax exempt by the age of the van? may be worth checking out first. Hi Spence, I've been done quite a bit of research into it before buying. Check this out: http://www.tfl.gov.uk/tfl/roadusers/lez/check-by-type/default.aspx choose, "motorhome", then "diesel or biodiesel" then "Historic (pre 1973) and out pops the answer = "You are exempt from the Low Emission Zone. You do not need to take any action."
Sun 13 Nov 2011 @ 22:37
Time in GMT

Author

Message

Anon
Deleted
Posts :
Location :
Status : Offline

Hi and a few questions

Hi everyone.

Yesterday I placed the winning bid on a 1972 CF with a Debonair body. I've been wanting a Debonair for a sometime (a CA actually) but figured a CF would be easier to live with, if not quite so cute. It's in OK condition & comes complete with a weezing 1600cc lump.

I've spent the last few days trawling through the forum getting familiar with what's going on & learning loads.

I'm looking to do a Frontera Turbo Diesel conversion, an axle swap and run it on vege oil. I'm running my current van on WVO and have built a filtration contraption to process the oil from a chip shop so I'm a little out of practice when it comes to paying £1.30+ for fuel.

The 2.3 Frontera engine (with a front beam, sump, rocker & oil pipe swap) seems to be a bolt up job, however I wonder if the 1600 gearbox is up to it? Is the 'box the same as later vans? Or should I be looking for a later 'box too?

Also, what engine electrics should I looking to get from the Frontera donor? I'm assuming/hoping there is no ECU on a 2.3 Frontera engine, but there would be a little wiring involved to swap from petrol electrics to the diesel electrics.

Cheers
Finn

----------------------

Sun 30 Oct 2011 @ 18:46

Anon
Deleted
Posts :
Location :
Status : Offline

Hello Finn,
Congratulations on buying a nice van.
The first question I must ask you, your address says you're in London, does that put you inside the Low Emission Zone or are you, fortunately, outside it?
I have run a diesel engine in my previous CF but this time I've opted for LPG which is basically costing me 16p a mile in fuel.
Hope this helps.

Rae & Ann

----------------------

Sun 30 Oct 2011 @ 19:04

Anon
Deleted
Posts :
Location :
Status : Offline

Frontera 2.3D engine won't marry to the Vauxhall gearbox. Really needs the CF Opel 2.3D clutch housing for either the Opel 4-speed (similar side turret for the gear lever) or ZF 4- or 5-speed; either will require propellor shaft swap or modification & ZF box needs spacers on the transmission cross member ends to clear underside of cab floor.

Frontera 2.3D injection pump may have sensors attached for an ECU: best to run it with ECU (better cold starting etc.).

----------------------

Sun 30 Oct 2011 @ 19:05

Anon
Deleted
Posts :
Location :
Status : Offline

Yep, I'm in the LEZ, but tax exempt = LEZ exempt.

Hmmm, not as simple as I thought.

I did consider LPG, but would like to get a few more horses under the hood. Given the work & parts involved in a 2.3 slant upgrade I figured it makes sense to do a diesel conversion.

Sun 30 Oct 2011 @ 20:05

Anon
Deleted
Posts :
Location :
Status : Offline

Also, wondering what diff ratio it is likely to have?

Sun 30 Oct 2011 @ 20:13

Anon
Deleted
Posts :
Location :
Status : Offline

Kooda wrote:

but tax exempt = LEZ exempt.

Hello Finn,
What a result. Is it just tax exempt vehicles that are LEZ exempt or does it run a bit later?

Rae & Ann

----------------------

Sun 30 Oct 2011 @ 20:32

Anon
Deleted
Posts :
Location :
Status : Offline

Just tax exempt I'm afraid.
It was a big factor in choosing this particular van.

Sun 30 Oct 2011 @ 21:27

Anon
Deleted
Posts :
Location :
Status : Offline

Kooda wrote:

Just tax exempt I'm afraid.
It was a big factor in choosing this particular van.

Hello Finn,
I can fully understand the attractions of said van

Rae & Ann

----------------------

Sun 30 Oct 2011 @ 21:32

Anon
Deleted
Posts :
Location :
Status : Offline

Hi Finn,

I would just like to say welcome to the world of CF and good luck with your van.
Where abouts in the big smoke are you? It seems you may be the nearest club member to us so maybe in the future there could be a mini convoy to a meet?

Steve

Mon 31 Oct 2011 @ 18:16

Anon
Deleted
Posts :
Location :
Status : Offline

Hi Steve,

I'm living in the Hounslow area. I was wondering if there were any members close by as I often see a late model coach built CF parked in Chiswick.

Finn

Mon 31 Oct 2011 @ 20:38

Anon
Deleted
Posts :
Location :
Status : Offline

I've been really struggling to find info on the Opel bell housings & what fits what or does all the Opel stuff just bolt together.

Phil, Are the ZF bell housings for Opel pattern engines?

So this :

http://www.ebay.co.uk/itm/bedford-cf-2-5speed-gearbox-/280765270677?pt=UK_CarsParts_Vehicles_CarParts_SM&hash=item415eea0a95

would do the job on the Frontera engine? With the cross member mod of course.

Many thanks,
Finn

Tue 01 Nov 2011 @ 20:55

Anon
Deleted
Posts :
Location :
Status : Offline

Frontera 2.3D is the same block as the GM 2.3D in the CF so a ZF box from a CF Opel diesel should bolt on ok.

Diesel clutch housing has the timing pointer aperture in the bottom; CF2 ZF box on ebay looks like it's got the petrol clutch housing.

----------------------

Tue 01 Nov 2011 @ 21:02

Anon
Deleted
Posts :
Location :
Status : Offline

Kooda

I have just sent the seller a question asking for the ratios as there are 2 different 5 speed boxes.

----------------------

Tue 01 Nov 2011 @ 22:35

Anon
Deleted
Posts :
Location :
Status : Offline

also in london

we,re also in london, brixton/stockwell us londoners should have a little meet sometime. One thing if you change the engine in a tax exempt LEZ compliant van will it not change the LEZ rating and also we're changing the use of our ice cream van to a camper will that change anything cheers john&louise

Tue 01 Nov 2011 @ 23:17

Anon
Deleted
Posts :
Location :
Status : Offline

I used to live in Brixton, behind St Matthews church.

No, a Tax exempt diesel is also LEZ exempt, so the engine swap wont effect the LEZ status. They don't care about the use of the vehicle, just the cash, I'm afraid.

If it is going to effect your van it might be worth asking a few questions as to exact mechanics of things. I was quoted £3000 for a Diesel Particulate filter (DPF) and paperwork, while you can buy a new DPF of our favorite auction site for £200. I havn't looked any further into it as I've bought the Bedford instead.

Gethin, He is sending me a pic of the ID plate on the 'box. I'm not sure what I'm looking for but hope it will be apparent. Sounds like its the wrong bell housing for me anyway. I have found a GM 4 speed diesel box, but would like the 0.81 5th. I saw there were 2 gear sets on the history page. The wide ratio might be nice with a high diff ratio (3.5 or something from somewhere) giving a long cruising gear while maintaining the spread. Or of course the closer ratio for better lap times.

Wed 02 Nov 2011 @ 10:39

Anon
Deleted
Posts :
Location :
Status : Offline

The reality of this wee project is sinking in. The crux of it seems to be getting the CF front beam for a diesel. I found one with disc's but upon explaining to the chap what I intended doing, he thought it was such a good idea he was now going to keep the beam.

Thu 03 Nov 2011 @ 10:12

Anon
Deleted
Posts :
Location :
Status : Offline

Your van may be tax exempt as it is, by placing a deisel lump in it would you still be compliant with the LEZ as by putting a later engine in counter act it, even though you'll still be tax exempt by the age of the van? may be worth checking out first.

Congrats with buying your van, and hope you have a lot of fun and miles with it.

Message for the COW. you would still be liable for the LEZ, the LEZ applies to all vehicles with deisel engines euro 3 or under, unless you have an approved particulate filter fitted, and then that would be part of your MOT emmissions check every year to make you LEZ compliant.

read my blog in general chat regards the LEZ.

----------------------

Sun 13 Nov 2011 @ 19:54

Anon
Deleted
Posts :
Location :
Status : Offline

welcome to the club finn

looks like im in the middle as im in beckton :)

----------------------

Sun 13 Nov 2011 @ 20:34

Anon
Deleted
Posts :
Location :
Status : Offline

I picked up the van yesterday just north of Newcastle, then drove to Scotland to pick up a 5 speed ZF box and 9/37 CWP & Diff. I stopped over 1/2 way and rolled up in London about lunch time today. Buying a van unseen via ebay is not my desired M.O. but I think it's an OK deal. I was surprised how peppy the 1600cc engine was, but it really needs a tune & the ignition sorting out. I'm not to fussed about sorting out the ignition as I picked up a 23DTR out of a Frontera on Friday & my energy is best placed on the conversion.

One thing I didn't really get a handle on was the clutch/flywheel requirements. The engine has a clutch & flywheel, so I'll just see how they marry up (or not). Plenty of food for thought.

Sun 13 Nov 2011 @ 22:27

Anon
Deleted
Posts :
Location :
Status : Offline

spence wrote:

Hi Spence,

I've been done quite a bit of research into it before buying.

Check this out: http://www.tfl.gov.uk/tfl/roadusers/lez/check-by-type/default.aspx choose, "motorhome", then "diesel or biodiesel" then "Historic (pre 1973) and out pops the answer = "You are exempt from the Low Emission Zone.
You do not need to take any action."

Sun 13 Nov 2011 @ 22:37

Time in GMT

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